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Message de nanas390 posté le 06-11-2019 à 14:42:09 (S | E | F)
Hello! Je viens de rédiger cette brève introduction et j'aimerais avoir vos avis sur la pertinence de ma problématique et de mon plan (et pour toutes autres remarques d'ailleurs)
Merci d'avance les anglicistes
"One father is enough to govern one hundred sons, but not a hundred sons, one father." said the anglican pastor, poet and English orator of the early 17th century, George Herbert.
This quote highlights the relationship between parental's figure of authority and the children.
That's what is at stake in the dossier we'll studied. It deals with the notion of « l'amour, l'amitié » through the angle of approach of children and father relationships, and sometimes the border between love and authority is critiziced.
So, document A is an extract from the thirteenth chapter of the novel Our Mutual Friend, written by Charles Dickens, and it was published in 1864. The novel is composed of several books and revolves around the murder of John Harmon, a man who was supposed to return to London to inherit a large fortune from his estranged father and marry a woman named Bella Wilfer. In the extract under scrutiny, Mortimer Lightwood, a lawyer whose professional practice focuses on the Harmon family and their inheritance, and Eugene Wrayburn, a lawyer too and a close friend of Mortimer Lightwood, are having a conversation.
Document B is an excerpt from a memoir entitled Under a Wing A memoir, written by Reeve Lindbergh and which was published in 1998. Reeve Lindbergh was the youngest child in her family. Her parents were two famous aviators and the story relates what it was like to be a part of that extraordinary family. In the extract under scrutiny, the narrator is speaking of her father as an american hero.
The last document, document C is an extract from King Lear, a tragedy written by William Shakespeare. It tells the tale of a king who bequeaths his power and land to two of his three daughters, after they declare their love for him in an extremely fawning and obsequious manner.
In the extract under scrutiny, we have a passage when Lear wants his daughters to say how much they love him. He says he'll give the most to the daughter who says she loves him most, but Cornelia, one of his daughters is reluctent to it.
The question that can be raised is the following: how through demonstration of paternal love, a critic of authoritary relationship and social conventions are made ?
First, we will talk about the relations to the father for the children, then of the criticism of social conventions regarding status and marriages.
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Modifié par lucile83 le 06-11-2019 14:59
Message de nanas390 posté le 06-11-2019 à 14:42:09 (S | E | F)
Hello! Je viens de rédiger cette brève introduction et j'aimerais avoir vos avis sur la pertinence de ma problématique et de mon plan (et pour toutes autres remarques d'ailleurs)
Merci d'avance les anglicistes
"One father is enough to govern one hundred sons, but not a hundred sons, one father." said the anglican pastor, poet and English orator of the early 17th century, George Herbert.
This quote highlights the relationship between parental's figure of authority and the children.
That's what is at stake in the dossier we'll studied. It deals with the notion of « l'amour, l'amitié » through the angle of approach of children and father relationships, and sometimes the border between love and authority is critiziced.
So, document A is an extract from the thirteenth chapter of the novel Our Mutual Friend, written by Charles Dickens, and it was published in 1864. The novel is composed of several books and revolves around the murder of John Harmon, a man who was supposed to return to London to inherit a large fortune from his estranged father and marry a woman named Bella Wilfer. In the extract under scrutiny, Mortimer Lightwood, a lawyer whose professional practice focuses on the Harmon family and their inheritance, and Eugene Wrayburn, a lawyer too and a close friend of Mortimer Lightwood, are having a conversation.
Document B is an excerpt from a memoir entitled Under a Wing A memoir, written by Reeve Lindbergh and which was published in 1998. Reeve Lindbergh was the youngest child in her family. Her parents were two famous aviators and the story relates what it was like to be a part of that extraordinary family. In the extract under scrutiny, the narrator is speaking of her father as an american hero.
The last document, document C is an extract from King Lear, a tragedy written by William Shakespeare. It tells the tale of a king who bequeaths his power and land to two of his three daughters, after they declare their love for him in an extremely fawning and obsequious manner.
In the extract under scrutiny, we have a passage when Lear wants his daughters to say how much they love him. He says he'll give the most to the daughter who says she loves him most, but Cornelia, one of his daughters is reluctent to it.
The question that can be raised is the following: how through demonstration of paternal love, a critic of authoritary relationship and social conventions are made ?
First, we will talk about the relations to the father for the children, then of the criticism of social conventions regarding status and marriages.
-------------------
Modifié par lucile83 le 06-11-2019 14:59
Réponse : Problématique/ plan de bluestar, postée le 06-11-2019 à 19:49:51 (S | E)
"One father is enough to govern one hundred sons, but not a hundred sons, one father." said the anglican (majuscule) pastor, poet and English orator of the early 17th century, George Herbert.
This quote highlights the relationship between parental's figure of authority and the children.
That's what is at stake in the dossier we'll studied. It deals with the notion of « l'amour, l'amitié » through the angle of approach of children and father relationships, and sometimes the border between love and authority is critiziced.(je pense que vous voulez dire"
"critiqued"
Document B is an excerpt from a memoir entitled Under a Wing A memoir, written by Reeve Lindbergh and which was published in 1998. Reeve Lindbergh was the youngest child in her family. Her parents were two famous aviators and the story relates what it was like to be a part of that extraordinary family. In the extract under scrutiny, the narrator is speaking of her father as an american (majuscule) hero.
The last document, document C is an extract from King Lear, a tragedy written by William Shakespeare. It tells the tale of a king who bequeaths his power and land to two of his three daughters, after they declare their love for him in an extremely fawning and obsequious manner.
In the extract under scrutiny, we have a passage when Lear wants his daughters to say how much they love him. He says he'll give the most to the daughter who says she loves him most, but Cornelia, one of his daughters is reluctent to it.
The question that can be raised is the following: how through demonstration of paternal love, a critic of authoritary relationship and social conventions are made ?(ordre de mots a revoir)
First, we will talk about the relations to the father for the children, then of the criticism of social conventions regarding status and marriages.
-------------------
Pretty good - but check the name of the youngest daughter..
Réponse : Problématique/ plan de nanas390, postée le 06-11-2019 à 20:39:59 (S | E)
J'ai corrigé les fautes que vous avez relevés:
"One father is enough to govern one hundred sons, but not a hundred sons, one father." said the Anglican pastor, poet and English orator of the early 17th century, George Herbert.
This quote highlights the relationship between parental's figure of authority and the children.
That's what is at stake in the dossier we'll studied. It deals with the notion of « l'amour, l'amitié » through the angle of approach of children and father relationships, and sometimes the border between love and authority is critiqued.
Document A is an extract from the thirteenth chapter of the novel Our Mutual Friend, written by Charles Dickens, and it was published in 1864. The novel is composed of several books and revolves around the murder of John Harmon, a man who was supposed to return to London to inherit a large fortune from his estranged father and marry a woman named Bella Wilfer. In the extract under scrutiny, Mortimer Lightwood, a lawyer whose professional practice focuses on the Harmon family and their inheritance, and Eugene Wrayburn, a lawyer too and a close friend of Mortimer Lightwood, are having a conversation.
Document B is an excerpt from a memoir entitled Under a Wing A memoir, written by Reeve Lindbergh and which was published in 1998. Reeve Lindbergh was the youngest child in her family. Her parents were two famous aviators and the story relates what it was like to be a part of that extraordinary family. In the extract under scrutiny, the narrator is speaking of her father as an American hero.
The last document, document C is an extract from King Lear, a tragedy written by William Shakespeare. It tells the tale of a king who bequeaths his power and land to two of his three daughters, after they declare their love for him in an extremely fawning and obsequious manner.
In the extract under scrutiny, we have a passage when Lear wants his daughters to say how much they love him. He says he'll give the most to the daughter who says she loves him most, but Cornelia, one of his daughters is reluctent to it.
The question that can be raised is the following one: how do these documents, through demonstration of paternal love, made a critic of authoritary relationship and social conventions?
First, we will talk about the relations to the father for the children, then of the criticism of social conventions regarding status and marriages.
Voici la suite de mon étude, qu'en pensez-vous?
First, we can see that in the three documents, we have this question of the relations to the father at stake. Indeed, mother only appeared in document B and is just quoted, related to the father. So in a first time, we will focus ont the image of children respecting their father. In document B, Reeve's father is idolized, trough expressions like « an american heroe » or hyperboles such as « a greater heroe », moreover we can notice that this fame is noticed by her son only after her father's death. She respected her father but make the reader understand that she didn't really knew him when he was alive.
This idea of a respected father can also be seen on document A, with the repetitions of the expression « respected father ». Besides, this repetition also appeared under the substitution « MRF » for « My respected father ». It sounds like Eugene really associates this qualification to his father.
The idea of a respected father also appears on document C with the demonstration of love made by Goneril for his father with the comparison « I love you more than words can wield the matter ». She exaggerated her love to win her father's favor and have land. So we have a demonstration of love but which is fake.
That leads me to my second point, which is that paternal figure is not just shown as a respected one in the extracts. First, in document A we can see that this question of the role of the father is at stake. Indeed, the question of authority and control over their children can be raised. In document A and C, the figure of the father seems to be very present. We can notice it first in document C with the textual length of the father's speech. He speeks more than the other two girls reunited, and he is the one who imposes to her children what to talk about : their love for him. So all the extract is turned to him. In document A, we have the image of a father who is all the time on the back of his son, we learn moreover in the excerpt that he wants to marry a rich woman so that the money of the latter ensure its future.
In document B that's different, we have a father who is described as an amazing traveller but who is not really present for his children. Another fact that well illustrates this attitude can be seen with the death of Reeve's brother affected his parents as they flee.
So we talk about the biased love between fathers and their children, as the children both respect, sometimes idealize him even if they don't were close, but also as there is a criticism made by the children regarding the authority and the paternal rôle. But what does it say about the social context in which they live in ? What does it tell about social conventions and status ?
Indeed, we can notice that all the children came from a high social status. In document C, the father is the king, we have lawyers in document A and famous people, working in publicity, writers and also as aviators in document B. And in all these documents, we find this question of reputation.
The character of Reeve is impressed by his father in document B, as the character of Goneril in document C, whereas the character of Eugene in document A and of Cornelia in document C aren't as they want to rebel against their authority.
Then, we can talk about the ridicule that shines in this extract. First, we have to remind that being married was considered as an achievement for women in the 19t century, as they were dependant on others to have a social status and to live, they passed from the protection of their father to the one of their husband. But in document A, we talk about a father who wants to marry his son, so it breaks the rule of the marriage plot. Indeed, it turns out that Eugene's dad has found a wife for Eugene, and this woman has a good chunk of money coming with her. Eugene isn't impressed and he even claims he can't get married because he gets bored too easily.
In document C, Cornelia doesn't want to impress his father too in faking love in the aim of winning lands as her sister. She protests, as Eugene, and she is also against the idea to be married, as it's shown from line 98 to 107. Besides, she listens to her sisters' empty speeches and thinks this love contest is stupid. Words of love are no substitute for actually feeling love, and her love is richer than her ability to flatter. She explains that she's not going to make a big insincere public speech about it, « I cannot heave my heart into my mouth," meaning her words are never sufficient enough to express her love for Lear. »
It shows that in public she has to show something she doesn't want to, which is fake. Her rebellion is well-shown when she repeated several times « nothing » to her father, she refused to obey to him, that means she neglected his authority. That's why at the end of the extract, King Lear explains that he disowns his own daughter. The ridicule of the situation is shown by Cornelia with the fact she speaks of herself with a third person « what should cornelia do ».
Finally, we can see that relationship between fathers and their children is linked to nature in all the documents. What is interesting to notice is the authenticity of nature, to link nature in a text dealing with paternal love. In document A, thr lexical field of light is used when the subject of the discussion is announced, there's “candlelight” on line 5, “artificial brilliancy” on line 5,“a glow” on line 5
“twilight” line 5. In document B, it's through the notion of travel that we find this idea, with sentences like “navigated by the stars and watched the great surfaces of the earth” on line 9, or “i would rather have birds than airplanes”. It shows the love of nature felt by Reeve”s fater, but also that Reeve admires the discoveries, travels of her parents but that, on the other way, she doesn't understand the artificial world in which they evolve. The fragility of nature is also at stake in this excerpt, which could be a metaphor of the fragility of relationships between humans, we have to take care of each other. In document C, many links to nature are used to legitimate power and King Lear's right to ask for the demonstration of his daughter's love “with shadowy forests, plenteous rivers, wide-skirted meads” from line 64 to 66 and “by the sacred radiance of te sun, and the night” on line 113. The magnitude of nature is shown in Lear's speech as a reflection of his own power.
To conclude, we have seen that in these three documents, boundaries between true paternal love for their children and the inverse is at stake. As the characters come from high social rang they have to behave in a certain way, and even to fake their feelings to be as they should be. The authenticity of love is showed not by the speech to the others, but by images like metaphor with nature.
Réponse : Problématique/ plan de bluestar, postée le 07-11-2019 à 14:02:24 (S | E)
First, we can see that in the three documents, we have this question of the relations to the father at stake. Indeed, mother only appeared in document B and is just quoted, related to the father. So in a first time, we will focus ont the image of children respecting their father. In document B, Reeve's father is idolized, trough expressions like « an american (majuscule)heroe(orthographe) » or hyperboles such as « a greater heroe », moreover we can notice that this fame is noticed by her son only after her father's death. She respected her father but make(conjugaison) the reader understand that she didn't really knew (temps)him when he was alive.
This idea of a respected father can also be seen on document A, with the repetitions of the expression « respected father ». Besides, this repetition also appeared under the substitution « MRF » for « My respected father ». It sounds like Eugene really associates this qualification to his father.
The idea of a respected father also appears on document C with the demonstration of love made by Goneril for his father with the comparison « I love you more than words can wield the matter ». She exaggerated her love to win her father's favor and have land. So we have a demonstration of love but which is fake.
That leads me to my second point, which is that paternal figure is not just shown as a respected one in the extracts. First, in document A we can see that this question of the role of the father is at stake. Indeed, the question of authority and control over their children can be raised. In document A and C, the figure of the father seems to be very present. We can notice it first in document C with the textual length of the father's speech. He speeks more than the other two girls reunited combined, and he is the one who imposes to decides for her children what to talk about : their love for him. So all the
extract is turned to him. In document A, we have the image of a father who is all the time on the back of his son, we learn moreover in the excerpt that he wants to marry a rich woman so that the money of the latter ensure its future.
In document B that's different, we have a father who is described as an amazing traveller but who is not really present for his children. Another fact that well illustrates this attitude can be seen with the death of Reeve's brother affected his parents as they flee.
)So we talk about the biased love between fathers and their children, as the children both respect, sometimes idealize him even if they don't were close, but also as there is a criticism made by the children regarding the authority and the paternal rôle. But what does it say about the social context in which they live in ? What does it tell about social conventions and status ?
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