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    Near- next to

    << Forum anglais: Questions sur l'anglais || En bas

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    Near- next to
    Message de cirkas posté le 19-05-2010 à 17:33:01 (S | E | F)

    Hello

    What is the difference between these two words ?:

    Near /next to? please help me

    He's sitting next to his wife.
    Il est assis à côté de sa femme.

    The bank's next to the post-office
    La banque est à côté de la poste

    is it correct to say :

    He's sitting near to his wife...
    Thanks



    -------------------
    Modifié par lucile83 le 19-05-2010 17:49


    Réponse: Near- next to de lucile83, postée le 19-05-2010 à 17:52:38 (S | E)
    Bonjour,
    Merci de faire un double clic sur le mot et vous obtenez un dictionnaire en ligne qui vous donnera toutes les informations.
    Cordialement.




    Réponse: Near- next to de gerondif, postée le 19-05-2010 à 18:55:45 (S | E)
    Bonjour,

    near signifie à côté de, comme le dirait le dictionnaire, sans préjugé de position( devant, derrière, sur le côté)
    Don't go near the edge of the cliff.

    next to est d'après les dessins des manuels de sixième un peu plus près que near, et plutôt sur le côté.

    He was sitting next to her / close to her / beside her (plus littéraire).

    near to est plus spécifique : voir double click




    Réponse: Near- next to de notrepere, postée le 19-05-2010 à 19:19:58 (S | E)
    Hello:

    I would also like to point out that this statement is not proper grammar:

    The bank's next to the post-office

    In this case, the apostrophe indicates possessiveness:

    The bank's money
    The bank's employees

    It should not be used to collapse a noun with the verb to be:

    The bank's bank is next to the post-office

    You can only use an apostrophe as a contraction in specific cases:

    He is = he's
    She is = she's
    It is = it's
    etc.

    Cordialement


    Réponse: Near- next to de gerondif, postée le 19-05-2010 à 19:29:01 (S | E)
    Hello, notrepere,

    I would have said that this 's is more difficult to pronounce than the original is, but it still sounds to me like a contraction of is. But it does sound awkward !




    Réponse: Near- next to de traviskidd, postée le 20-05-2010 à 01:22:23 (S | E)
    near = close to (près/proche de)
    next to = beside (à côté de)

    The contraction of "bank is" into "bank's" is correct.


    Réponse: Near- next to de may, postée le 20-05-2010 à 03:07:45 (S | E)
    Bonsoir cirkas

    is it correct to say :

    He's sitting near to his wife.

    No, it's not correct to say he's sitting near to his wife .

    However, It's safe to say:

    He's sitting next to his wife.

    He's sitting close to his wife.

    He's sitting near his wife.

    and also:


    The bank's next to the post-office.

    The bank's close to the post-office.

    The bank's near the post-office.

    Bye,



    -------------------
    Modifié par may le 20-05-2010 03:13


    Réponse: Near- next to de notrepere, postée le 20-05-2010 à 03:57:44 (S | E)
    Hello traviskidd:

    While there doesn't seem to be any written rule against this that I could find, I also do not see any rule prescribing it either (unless it exists solely in GB English). Since the rules of grammar exist to outline the proper use of a language, and the rules do not cover this topic, this seems to be an indication that it's not considered "proper". While it is fairly common to hear something like this in spoken English, the general consensus seems to be to not use it in formal writing.

    Everything I found on the apostrophe in English grammar is for specific prescribed contractions (he's she's it's you're etc. ) and possessives. So, I would have to say, personally, I don't like it. It seems contrary to the rules.

    Amicalement

    -------------------
    Modifié par notrepere le 20-05-2010 04:35


    Réponse: Near- next to de lucile83, postée le 20-05-2010 à 07:48:50 (S | E)
    Hello,
    I think people would rarely say 'the bank's near the post-office' and surely not write it, concerning the contraction 's.
    Regards.


    Réponse: Near- next to de willy, postée le 20-05-2010 à 09:12:26 (S | E)
    Hello!

    Here is what Michael Swan writes about contractions in "Practical English Usage" (OUP):

    "Contractions are made with nouns as well as pronouns: we say not only 'She's late' but also 'Her mother's late'. However, we don't usually 'write' contracted verb forms after nouns, except 's: "Peter's been here" and "Your mother's looking well" are normal, but it would be unusual to write "Peter'd been there" or "Your mother'll fix it".

    -------------------
    Modifié par lucile83 le 20-05-2010 09:16
    mise en page


    Réponse: Near- next to de traviskidd, postée le 20-05-2010 à 09:29:54 (S | E)
    Hello notrepere and lucile.

    People would most certainly say "The bank's near the post office." Admittedly they would be less likely to write it, but if they did it wouldn't be wrong (unless the bank isn't near the post office of course ).

    In fact contractions are generally less likely to be used in writing, especially in formal writing, and there certainly are rules prohibiting contractions in certain cases (subject-auxiliary at the end of a sentence for example). But no rule limits subject-auxiliary contractions to those where the subject is a pronoun.

    As for the use of "to" after "near", my sense is the following:

    - after "near", "to" is allowed but rare
    - after "nearer", "to" is required
    - after "nearest", "to" is recommended but not required.

    See you.

    -------------------
    Modifié par traviskidd le 20-05-2010 09:32
    Hello willy; I agree with Mr. Swan.


    Réponse: Near- next to de cirkas, postée le 20-05-2010 à 10:09:54 (S | E)
    bonjour merci de vos réponses pour the bank's je l'ai vu dans mon livre Assimil l'Anglais^^


    Réponse: Near- next to de notrepere, postée le 20-05-2010 à 18:03:21 (S | E)
    Hello!

    Well, this is certainly an interesting discussion and there obviously is not going to be a definitive answer. The BBC English page (and every other grammar page I've found on this subject) basically prescribes the use of the apostrophe in two cases:

    1) Specific contractions
    2) Possessives

    Lien Internet


    In the (at least) 20 other pages on the correct use of the apostrophe, I find zero rules or examples prescribing this particular use. In the one page that I found (see: Lien Internet
    ), the author admits that this usage is ambiguous. When I have seen it used in *written* English, it has only been used with *proper nouns* or with reference to animate objects and not inanimate objects (as in Mr. Swan's examples). I've never seen "The tree's next to the house". This could be a GB vs. US preference since you cite OUP.

    Everything in me says that this usage is plain wrong and should not be encouraged considering the weight of evidence neither prescribing its use nor specifying how it is to be used. I relent, however. Thou shalt do as you wish and face the consequences later. Or in the words of Forrest Gump: "Mama always said, 'Stupid is as stupid does'".


    -------------------
    Modifié par notrepere le 20-05-2010 18:04
    Mr. Swan is wrong, I say!


    Réponse: Near- next to de gerondif, postée le 20-05-2010 à 18:15:03 (S | E)
    Hello,

    Mickael Swan obviously ruffles your feathers, notrepere !!

    It's funny because I had so far never wondered whether it was right or wrong to turn is into 's, I just said that sometimes, it was easier not to contract it as in : James is absent. I never thought it could be considered wrong to say: the car's in the garage...

    Your BBC sheet says: "the car's lights" which I could object to formally, "car" being an object and not a human being but well.....




    Réponse: Near- next to de notrepere, postée le 20-05-2010 à 19:39:54 (S | E)
    Hello gérondif!

    Your BBC sheet says: "the car's lights" which I could object to formally, "car" being an object and not a human being but well.....

    I must not have been clear in my message! This fits under rule #2 "possessives". In this case, "car's" is a possessive (the lights of the car) not a contraction (The car is lights). I was only saying that in the cases where I had seen non-standard contractions (as Mr. Swan points out), they were only used with proper nouns and animate objects: Brian's back in town, Jim's not going out tonight, Her mother's late, My father's a very good man.

    I did, however, like the pun on "Mr. Swan" and "ruffling my feathers".


    Réponse: Near- next to de gerondif, postée le 20-05-2010 à 19:42:49 (S | E)
    I agree about the possessives ! I would just have said: the lights of the car or the car-lights.




    Réponse: Near- next to de lucile83, postée le 20-05-2010 à 21:34:26 (S | E)
    Hello,

    That's a very interesting subject indeed!
    Why not create a test about possessive cases or contractions which would be quite elaborated,clear and precise?
    I am sure each of you could do that! I am not joking, I am serious!
    Your test could be included in a Newsletter; it would be great

    I am looking forward to reading a test of yours.
    Best wishes!


    Réponse: Near- next to de notrepere, postée le 21-05-2010 à 18:10:01 (S | E)
    Hello Gérondif:

    I understand what you're saying. How can an inanimate object show possession? That's a very good question and it does seem a little strange.

    Today, I found two pages that prescribe the contraction of nouns:

    Lien Internet


    "Bob's going to the store to create a bacon hat instead" = Bob is going to the store to create a bacon hat instead

    Lien Internet


    Bob's quick guide to the apostrophe, you idiots
    "The cat's out of the bag" = The cat is out of the bag

    So, I think it's clear that the rules are not clear nor consistent. It would be interesting to research this topic starting with older grammar books and moving to more recent grammar books. One must also recognize that the internet is NOT a scholarly resource, so just because something is published on the WWW does not mean that it is accepted as fact everywhere.

    Since there is no definitive answer to this question, I am not going to be the one to create a test on this subject. I do, of course, have my opinions which I have already stated.
    -------------------
    Modifié par notrepere le 21-05-2010 18:11



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